MR. SPEAKER: Shri Shiv Shanker, we are not discussing about the procedure on division now. We are only on the point of extension of time of the Joint Committee.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI P. SHIV SHANKER : We are against the extension and that is the point. We are against the extension and, that is why, we are asking for a division. ... (Interruptions)
... (Interruptions)
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : Sir, please allow us also to speak.
SHRI PURNO A. SANGMA : I would take only two minutes. I do not take much time.
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : We should also be heard ... (Interruptions)
Sir, as far as the decision of the House is concerned, it is governed by rules 364, 365, 366 and 367 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Lok Sabha. The rule is very clear as to how the decision of the House would have to be taken. Now that a motion has been put for the decision of the House, only rule 367, which has already been read by Prof. Kurien, remains operative.
I think, the hon. Speaker now has to decide whether the decision of the House would be taken by a voice vote or not. Since it has been challenged, it has to be decided whether it should be done by a voice vote or by a division. That is the only question. We do not have to decide about the merits and demerits of the Bill. It is a question of procedure and the procedure is very clear that the decision of the House has to be taken in accordance with rules 364, 365, 366 and 367. Now, of all these rules, rule 367 is the operative part. I agree with Prof. Kurien that a division has to be there on this.
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is a matter of extending the period by a motion.
SHRI P. CHIDAMBARAM (SIVAGANGA): The motion either has to be passed or defeated.
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : Whatever has been said by Shri Sangma is correct. I do not deny it ... (Interruptions)
SHRI K. KARUNAKARAN (THIRUVANANTHAPURAM): The issue is very specific. The motion has already been put before the House ... (Interruptions) Now, you take the vote of the House ... (Interruptions)
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : Sir, now the matter has a very restricted and a limited scope. But by taking advantage of this particular opportunity, unnecessary aspersions have been cast. I can understand the technical point and the legal aspect of the issue. But why should one make some allegations that some section of the people are in favour of the traders? This thing should not happen. It is a highly technical matter ... (Interruptions) If you shout like this, I can also shout ... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Sirpotdar, please.
SHRI MADHUKAR SIRPOTDAR : Sir, my contention is that procedure that has been laid down under rule 367 is absolutely correct. My humble request to the House is that only extension of the time for submission of the Report has been sought for and it should be allowed ... (Interruptions) If the Bill is to be defeated, the entire House is welcome to do it ... (Interruptions) The decision of the House on the motion has already been taken through a voice vote and let the business of the House now continue. Could we come back to a subject on which a decision has already been given? ... (Interruptions) That is my submission... (Interruptions)
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
SEVERAL HON. MEMBERS: Sir, we want division.
MR. CHAIRMAN: I called Shri Jaipal Reddy.
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : Sir, there is no need for further discussion. Please take the vote of the House. ...(Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Please take your seat.
... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: The Minister is on his legs. Please take your seats.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: This is not proper. Please take your seats.
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : Sir, why are you allowing a debate? ...(Interruptions) We have heard enough on this. ...(Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Please take your seat.
SHRI S. JAIPAL REDDY : There is no need for a debate. ...(Interruptions) The Motion is already moved.
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
MR. SPEAKER: Nothing will go on record except what Shri Khurana says.
(Interruptions)*
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
.. ʶɴɶÉÆEò®ú VÉÒ ÊºlÉÊiÉ +¤É ªÉ½þ ½þè ÊEò +vªÉIÉ VÉÒ ºÉ¨ÉªÉ nùä SÉÖEòä ½þèÆ +Éè®ú ªÉ½þ ¨ÉÉä¶ÉxÉ +vªÉIÉ VÉÒ EòÒ iÉ®ú¡ò ºÉä ½þè* +É{É =xÉEòä ºÉÉlÉ ¤ÉÉnù ¨ÉäÆ ¤Éè`ö VÉÉBÆ +Éè®ú EòÉä<Ç ®úɺiÉÉ ÊxÉEòɱÉä* ªÉÊnù +É{É Ê´Énùc÷É±É Eòä ʱÉB Eò½þäÆMÉä iÉÉä ¨ÉèÆ Ê´Énùc÷É Eò®úxÉä Eòä ʱÉB iÉèªÉÉ®ú ½þÚÆ* ¨ÉÖZÉä EòÉä<Ç BiÉ®úÉWÉ xɽþÒÆ ½þè... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
.. +vªÉIÉ VÉÒ +É{É ¨ÉÒÊ]õÆMÉ ¤ÉÖ±ÉÉ ±ÉäÆ +Éè®ú =ºÉ¨ÉäÆ ¡òèºÉ±ÉÉ Eò®ú ±ÉäÆ*______________________________________________________________________
* Not recorded
MR. SPEAKER: What is this? You are all senior Members. Is this the way to behave in the House?
... (Interruptions)
SHRI K. KARUNAKARAN : Sir, is this the way the House should function? Now, it is for the Speaker to decide on the issue.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI P. SHIV SHANKER: He should decide. Does he want to withdraw the motion? Does he agree for withdrawal of the motion or not? If he does not want to agree for withdrawal, we are against this motion and we want division. This is the simple point..(Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Please hear me first.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : Sir, there are two alternatives. Either the Bill has to be witdrawn... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Basu Deb Acharia, please take your seat.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : Sir, when the motion is before the House, there is no question of any debate on it. Now, you have to take the vote of the House. You allow division now... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Basu Deb Acharia, please take your seat.
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, please understand.
... (Interruptions)
... (´ªÉ´ÉvÉÉxÉ)
MR. SPEAKER: Please take your seats.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI VIJAY GOEL : It was the unanimous decision they had taken. ... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, please take your seats.
... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: We are not discussing anything now. Please take your seats.
... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: We are not discussing about the procedure under Rule 367 with regard to division. I have understood the feelings of the hon. Members. I am appealing to all the hon. Members that before I give my ruling, I think, it will be proper to discuss it with the leaders of all the parties in my Chamber. Then I will give my ruling.
... (Interruptions)
SOME HON. MEMBERS: No, Sir... (Interruptions)
PROF. P.J. KURIEN : It is violation of Rule 367... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: We are not discussing about the division now.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI AJAY CHAKRABORTY (BASIRHAT): We want division now.
1248 hours
(At this stage, Prof. P.J. Kurien, Shri Basu Deb Acharia and some
other hon. Members came and stood on the floor near the Table.)
... (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: The House stands adjourned to meet again at 1.30 p.m.
1249 hours
The Lok Sabha then adjourned till thirty minutes
past Thirteen of the Clock.
----
13.34 hours
The Lok Sabha re-assembled at thirty-four minutes
past Thirteen of the Clock.
(Shri K. Yerrannaidu in the Chair)
MOTION RE: REPORT OF JOINT COMMITTEE ON ESSENTIAL
(COMMODITIES (AMENDMENT) BILL- EXTENSION OF TIME - Contd
MR. CHAIRMAN: We will take up the next item on the agenda.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : We cannot go to the next issue unless this item is disposed of.
SHRI BHUBANESWAR KALITA (GUWAHATI): Sir, we have to dispose of the Motion. (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : The Motion is before the House. It has to be disposed of. (Interruptions) I am on a point of order. (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Hon. Members, please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN : All of you may sit down first.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BHUBANESWAR KALITA : Sir, you may give us the ruling. What is your ruling? Please give us your ruling. ... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down first. I am going to tell you something. Please sit down first. You are not giving scope for the Chair to speak.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down. I will tell you. Please sit down. What is the necessity for it now?
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BHUBANESWAR KALITA : Sir, you may dispose of this issue first and then go to the next item. ... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Nothing will go on record.
(Interruptions)*
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: I want to tell you something. You can ask anything later on. Please sit down first. Shri Radhakrishnan, please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI ANIL BASU (ARAMBAGH): Sir, as the motion is before the House, I, as a Member of this House, have a right to ask for voting on this issue. Sir, I demand a division on this issue. ... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down. On this issue only, the House has adjourned. Please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Nothing will go on record. Please sit down.
(Interruptions) *
MR. CHAIRMAN: Shri Basu Deb Acharya, please sit down. Shri Raghuvansh Prasad Singh, please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: I will give you a chance later. Just wait for a minute. I want to tell you something. Why are you doing this unnecessarily? There is no subject before the House. Why are you raising it unnecessarily?
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down. I will give you a chance later on. You will speak on what item? The House has adjourned on this issue only.
... (Interruptions)
______________________________________________________________________
* Not recorded
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down. Please wait for a minute. On this issue the House has adjourned. The hon. Speaker is discussing this issue with the floor leaders. Hence, we will go to the next item.
... (Interruptions)
SOME HON. MEMBERS: No.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI PRITHVIRAJ D. CHAVAN (KARAD): Sir, you cannot do like this. The Rules cannot be taken for granted.
... (Interruptions)
SHRI BASU DEB ACHARIA : Sir, I am on a point of order. ... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Hon. Speaker is discussing this issue with all the party leaders. So, the House is adjourned till 2.15 p.m.
1338 hours
The Lok Sabha then adjourned till Fifteen minutes
past Fourteen of the Clock.
-----
14.15 hours
The Lok Sabha re-assembled at fifteen minutes
past Fourteen of the Clock.
(Shri K. Yerrannaidu in the Chair)
MOTION RE: REPORT OF JOINT COMMITTEE ON ESSENTIAL
COMMODITIES (AMENDMENT) BILL EXTENSION OF TIME
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN : Please sit down. Let me speak.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: Please sit down.
... (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: The issue would be resolved shortly. That is why the House is adjourned till 2.45 p.m.
14.19 hours
The Lok Sabha then adjourned till forty-five minutes
past Fourteen of the Clock.
-----
04.12.98 Uncorrected/Not for Publication ###
)) 14.47 hrs.
The Lok Sabha re-assembled at forty seven minutes
past Fourteen of the Clock.
(Mr. Speaker in the Chair)
MOTION RE: REPORT OF JOINT COMMITTEE ON ESSENTIAL
COMMODITIES (AMENDMENT) BILL EXTENSION OF TIME
"The Essential Commodities Act would be immediately reviewed with a view to examine as to how the State Governments, Union Territory administrations can be empowered for effective action against those who hoard and cause artificial storage shortage and engage in trade malpractices, not only in respect of foodgrains but also in items of mass consumption, like vegetable, edible oil, etc. A Group of officials, under the Cabinet Secretary, would be constituted to make suitable recommendations both on the amendment of the Act and the steps that should be taken to improve the enforcement mechanism. Representatives of some of the States would also be included in this Group".